Friday, October 05, 2012

Debatable

Earlier this week, my fave news show moderator Warren Olney interviewed long-time political consultant Samuel Popkin for the "Reporter's Notebook" segment of his Oct. 2 edition of To the Point.

Why Popkin?

In 1980, as President Jimmy Carter prepared for his debates with GOP challenger Ronald Reagan, Popkin "played" the part of Reagan during the practice sessions. In his To The Point segment, Popkin offers up commentary on Carter and the obscure and mysterious phenomenon of presidential practice debates. It's a great interview that I cannot recommend highly enough. It's only about 10 minutes long and starts at the 40:40 point in the podcast.

I had listened to the Popkin interview before the Wednesday night debate and his insights were spot on. Obama's unease was precisely the sort that Popkin described incumbent presidents falling into for a variety of reasons. The segment was also loaded with great details. This one was my favorite: former Michigan Governor and Dem sweetheart Jennifer Granholm "played" Sarah Palin for Joe Biden while he prepared for the 2008 vice-presidential debate.

You cannot fully appreciate that delicious little tidbit until you dig a sample of Granholm for yourself:



Who is your mama?

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37 comments:

Jon Moore said...

I'll bet she was a cheerleader in high school.

Erin O'Brien said...

Dunno, Maybe we should ask Bachelor Number One.

Erin O'Brien said...

Dear GOP: This is the chick we're bringing in if we need someone to chew off Paul Ryan's dick.

Love,

Erin

B.E. Earl said...

I stopped playing with myself to come over here for this? I was expecting a new whipped-cream chugging video. ;)

Jon Moore said...

Dunno Erin O'Brien, I couldn't make out the audio on the Dating Game vid, but she certainly had that bouncy perkiness of a cheerleader; I'm sure she'd be up to the task you've laid before her.

Bill said...

I think Obama's unease stemmed from the fact that he didn't understand the subject matter. He felt intimidated by a competent Romney and was afraid to make an ass out of himself. He got back on his game the following day when he could childishly mock Romney becase he didn't have to face him. The adoring college crowds were the perfect audience. Kegger, dude!

Anonymous said...

Interesting insights, Bill. I'm not surprised in any way to find you parroting the FOX/GOP/Limbaugh talking point that the President is none too bright. Magna Cum Laude? Bahh! They give that to ALL the African exchange students at Harvard, and by giving it to a Muslim kid they satisfied two minorities with one diploma. Editor of the Harvard Law Review? Bahh! Affirmative action case-they had to meet a quota.

Here's what I think, for what it's worth.I believe the President and his debate team were victims of a failure of imagination. They never imagined that the Romney campaign would extend their self-stated policy of conducting a non-factual campaign beyond commercials to a debate setting, on national TV and in front of a live audience. They also couldn't foresee a moderator being unable or unwilling to keep the challenger to the pre-agreed format.

So Mr Romney lied his fucking balls off.

In doing so Mr Romney left so many crumbs laying around that the President's campaign could run a different ad every day between now and the election which could eviscerate Romney merely by contrasting his debate lies side-by-side with footage of him saying the exact opposite of his debate claims.


I'll look in in two weeks to see if you still think Mr Obama is a dullard. Thanks for calling.

MR

Anonymous said...

Bill said...
"I think..."

End Thread.

BTW...
I think Bill Maher got it right:
"Looks like Obama took my million and spent it on weed."

Bill said...

I did not say that he's stupid. I said that I don't think he understands the subject matter. Just like he doesn't understand business basics. Just like he thinks by pronouncing Pakistan, paw kee stahn, Muslims around the world will love us. Just like he thinks refusing care to a baby that survided an abortion is politically expedient. Just like he doesn't know how to pronounce Corpsman. There's more.

philbilly said...

I'd hit that.

Bill said...

Just saw a video where many university student admirers of the President, in Wisconsin, thought O should have been able to use his teleprompter. I'd link to it but you wouldn't watch it anyway.

Al The Retired Army Guy said...

"Bill said...
"I think..."

End Thread."

- Anonymous

Commentary like that is one reason I don't post here as often as I once did. We can disagree with each other, but we don't have to be uncivil. Comments like that keep me away.

Al
TRAG

P.S. Before someone brings it up, yes, I've said some things that some might construe as uncivil here and elsewhere. I've endeavored to restrain from such commentary in subsequent posts.

Erin O'Brien said...

Hi Al.

Bill said...

Hi Al. It's always a pleasure reading what you have to say.

Al The Retired Army Guy said...

@ Bill: Thanks. But I submit that most here, our humble hostess excepted, do not feel the same way, hence my scarcity as of late.

Al
TRAG

Erin O'Brien said...

Al, you are always welcome here. If some peeps get too salty for your taste so be it, but plenty of Owner's Manual readers enjoy your input.

Here's just one example.

Anonymous said...

@Everybody...

On occasion I suspect my posts have been the most uncivil of all. I regret if I ever offended TRAG because even though we probably have our differences I have nothing but respect for his dedication to his craft and his military service.
I don't think any regular poster here is not aware of my belief that "Bill" is a troll. Since that day long ago when he said he was making Erin's blog his home page he has been poison to this community, IMHO. My abusive comments to him reflect my belief. We have repeatedly asked him to provide empirical support of his assertions without success. One wonders what sort of gratification one gets by inhabiting a blog in which it is uncommon that anyone agrees with you. Do you think you're going to change our positions Bill? Are you just masochistic enough to keep coming back? Or, as is my belief, do you just get your rocks off by stirring shit? I have no idea if your name is Bill, if you are conservative or if you're blogging from a library in Fond du lac, Wisconsin instead of somewhere on the West Coast.
Anybody that doesn't know my name and home town just hasn't been paying attention.

Randy Johnson

Anonymous said...

@Al-You're always a pleasant sight here but you should talk about King Crimson more often.

Mike Robeson...

Anonymous said...

@ Al-If I could make a recommendation on a political program, try "Up With Chris Hayes" on MSNBC Saturday and Sunday mornings. Yes, it is MSNBC and yes, Mr Hayes is a lean-left kind of guy. But he is extraordinarily well prepared and open minded, and there aren't any guests whose metier is seeing if they can just drown out the other side. And he does invite right-leaning people, and he gives them equal time.

Any way, I hope you give it a peek and I hope you agree with my recommendation.

My best to you always TRAG.

MR

dean said...

I think that an incumbent is always at a disadvantage in a debate. The opponent can pretty much go anywhere they want, but the incumbent has a record which is what will be discussed. The incumbent is tied to the record and a good part of the time is thus automatically on the defensive.

I don't follow politics much, but it seems to me that when I have watched any sort of debate in which there is an incumbent, this has been the case.

I think the largest surprise was really that Romney didn't fuck it up completely.

Erin O'Brien said...

Dean! Yay!

Bill said...

When that guy was just RJ he vowed never to reply to my comments. Never the less, I'm assuming, by the vitriolic and bullying tone of his latest, that he takes my comments to heart and my comments, representing my beliefs, get under his skin in a major way. Randy Johnson! Yeah!

Al, In case you don't know who Chris Hayes is; he's the one who looks like Rachel Maddow's twin and he's also the one who is “uncomfortable” calling fallen U.S. troops “heroes”.

Bill said...

Dean: It is unfortunate that this incumbent would have to discuss his record. Akward!

Bill said...

The debate seems to have helped Romney in the polls but if you look here you can see why the President has huge advantage.

Bill said...

Romney could use a little more of this

Jon Moore said...

@Mike and Randy-
Really guys, really? You'd prefer Erin's blog to become a land where everyone is required to agree politically? How fucking boring would that be. You could have a mutual admiration society with everyone patting each other on the back commenting on how clever and astute and intellectually superior you all are. I daresay the site meter would see a marked decline of hits.
You may be surprised to learn that our Humble Hostess occasionally ventures into what you believe to be the land of darkness, or, the conservative blogosphere. She is sometimes harassed, harangued and lambasted by some of the closed minded, ignorant, politically dogmatic people who comment. They believe her to be an evil pariah simply because she has a different take on things; y'all have that in common with these right wingers you so despise.
You're quick to slap that coexist bumper sticker on your Prius and tout the "embrace diversity" mantra, but you don't let on that you must first be one of an approved group before you can enjoy this embracing coexistence. BTW, middle class, middle aged white guys who think our country is tumbling into the abyss need not apply.
I can't help but wonder, that if you were able to create your perfect Utopia where everyone thought the same and lived in harmony without the bad guys from the right fucking things up, how long it would take before you began consuming yourselves.



Anonymous said...

@ Jon Moore @7:59 10/07PM

Jon I'm not the Mike you're referring to, am I?

I don't see anything in my posts that you'd be motivated to make the particular comments in your posts.

MR AKA Mike Robeson.

Postscript-Erin, please PLEASE get another type of spam ID guard-this one is frickin' ridiculous with the illustrated part...

Anonymous said...

@ Bill @ 11:29 10/07/12

RE Your comment about Chris Hayes

It would behoove you to get on these here innerwebz and research the complete context about why Mr Hayes brought up this topic and how conflicted he was before you throw it out there to clearly imply that Mr Hayes is unpatriotic and hates the troops and the military.

MR dba Mike Robeson

Jon Moore said...

Actually Mike your comment to Al @10/6/12 11:05 PM sounded like have a nice cup of STFU to me so, yeah, that's how you got included.

Anonymous said...

You really need to evaluate yourself if you read STFU in that comment. Al, in his comments in the past has mentioned the great progressive (as in a musical style or genre, not in the political sense)band King Crimson. I am also a big fan of King Crimson, and so I have mentioned KC to Al TRAG once or twice. That's all there is there-amazing, isn't it? It just meant what it said.

MR

Erin O'Brien said...

We practice free speech here at the Owner's Manual.

Make no mistake, I appreciate everyone who visits these pages and I never take commenters for granted--no matter which side of the aisle they hail from. You're what makes this place come alive.

Thanks. I mean it.

As for the miserable word verification, I hate the damn thing, but I get inundated with spam if I turn it off. I even got hacked once. I am really sorry, but I simply have no choice.

Anonymous said...

In the spirit of civility and community:
"The foreign policy of the USA vis a vis the Islamic world is predicated on the manner in which the POTUS pronounces 'Pakistan'."-Discuss

P.S. I'm sitting at home in my jammies today because I'm a contract employee of a huge government bureaucracy and they have decided we should pause from our busy lives to honor Christopher Columbus, that iconic figure from the conquest and domination era of Western Civilization. Kill a Savage today in his honour. God Bless America.

Randy Johnson

Anonymous said...

Historical Footnote:(Blame Obama)

I was drunk in a bar in Columbus, Mississippi one night and a knife fight broke out. There are savages in Columbus, Miss. just in case you happen to pass through sometime. I have never been to Columbus, Ohio.

RJ

BTW...it's 47 degrees in Smithville today. Is it cold in Cleveland?

RJ

Bill said...

MR, I've watched Chris Hayes' program and saw the infamous "not comfortable" segment. He meant what he said and apologized when he realized it might cost him some of his, already small, audience. He's pretty much as far left as you can get which, I assume, explains your adoration.

Btw, does anyone else wonder what's going to happen to msnbc's programs, like Hayes, Maddow, Sharpton, etc., after the election, regardless of who wins?

RJ, The pronunciation of Pakistan is a small example but it's interesting that you picked that one.

Anonymous said...

I like Randy am off today to celebrate old Chris. Strange enough the government has directed us to swap Veterans Day for the day after Thanksgiving as a paid Holiday. Those of us who are vets were told we could use a vacation day to honor Vets if the work load allowed without any punishment. How about them apples.
James Old Guy

And yes it was directed by Army Support Command.

Al The Retired Army Guy said...

It is true that MR and I are King Crimson fans. I took his comment at face value for what it was, which was an encouragement to discuss that great prog-rock band. Fave tune? One More Red Nightmare. Bill Bruford is absolutely brilliant on that one.

As for allt he subsequent posts, let me just say I appreciate being welcomed here. I also appreciate the kind words directed my way.

I agree that if we all thought the same way the world would be a very boring place. I enjoy a vigorous debate just as much as the next guy/gal.

I've tried my best not to engage in language that is insulting, demeaning, etc. here and elsewhere. Sometimes I screw up, and that is unfortunate. The stakes surrounding this presidential election only heightens the propensity for uncivil discourse - this is the most passionate I've seen people about two candidates in my lifetime. Often, informed discourse gives way to vitriol, fueled by frustration when one feels one is losing the argument. Emotion takes over, and once that happens, the time for intelligent conversation is at an abrupt end.

As I've said, I've been guilty of saying some things I should have to people I like and respect. All I can do is endeavor to do better in future discussions. I think we'd all do well to adopt that mantra.

As far as Columbus Day goes, I spent most of it in a professional kitchen, watching students make espagnole sauce and derivatives of the same, and seeing at least three students cut themselves, with one slicing off a good bit of her thurmb. However, I did get to make my soon to be famous Cleveland Voodoo Butter Death Chili, so I've got that going for me.

Al
TRAG

Bill said...

Al, Erin's "owners manual" attracts me because it is entertaining. I enjoy her smart posts and the commentary offered up by the readers. I've been the object of lots of vitriol, condescension, insults and, I've even been wished dead. Honestly though, I haven't lost a minute of sleep over any of it. I'm quite sure that if we were all around a table, there would be a little more filtering used. I'm good with things the way they are here at Erin's place. I hope you continue to contribute. I know I will, as long as the owner allows.