Sunday, October 16, 2011

Occupy Cleveland, Oct. 15 2011

We were downtown yesterday and people seem genuinely interested in this, hence the pics. Actual eob-style content to return soon.

The rally/march staging area:

I spoke with the woman on the far right. She was genuinely energized and articulate, saying that she had a great deal of faith in the movement. She excused herself to join the group when they started singing. "We shall overcome."

The sign on her back.

The area was clean. Not sure who provided the port-o-pots.


The camp area was contained across the street from where they were rallying:

One twentysomething told me he recently left his job at McDonald's because he didn't want to work for slave wages. He'd been at the rally for five days and was going home to shower and get a decent night's sleep.




And a link I like with plenty of simple graphs and numbers about monetary inequity.

*  *  *

120 comments:

Nin Andrews said...

It looks so miserable, really. But I guess that's the way . . .

Freedom is never voluntarily given by the oppressor; it must be demanded by the oppressed.
-Martin Luther King, Jr.

Bill said...

Sometimes the oppressor provides port-o-pots,hands out coats, and approves a permit to sleep on the street.

Erin O'Brien said...

When a company has to pull a permit to put up a sign, drill a well or construct a building, it's big GOV and over-regulation. When a protester has to pull a permit, it's what, Bill? Benevolence?

The coats and blankets and food are largely donations from like-minded citizens and private entities. I don't think any of it comes courtesy of taxes.

The port-o-pots are probably courtesy of the city. You no-likey? Move to CLE and vote your heart.

Bill said...

I think the coats were provided by some of the police. In LA, the mayor, provided ponchos. Anything to keep a voter happy.

Anonymous said...

@Bill "Anything to keep a voter happy."

Incisive political commentary.

Again, what evidence can you provide that the police and mayor provided any material support?

P.S.
"approves a permit to sleep on the street"
Compassionate Conservatism?

RJ

Anonymous said...

I think I've finally got it. Progressives support Gov't intervention to assist the disadvantaged. Conservatives support Gov't intervention to keep from being annoyed by the riff raff.

RJ

Bill said...

RJ: You can google the police and mayor support. Both from newspaper articles. And, I'm not criticizing them. I'd give someone my coat if he/she needed it. I was just commenting on the oppressor comment.

alphadog said...

Erin, a question.
Your 20 something interviewee that had left McD's because he was tired of working for slave wages is planning on going home for a shower and a good nights sleep. Who's ponying up the jack for that? Is he still living with mom and dad? Is he on the dole? I'm just curious. Because it seems to me, if he is beholden to anyone but himself, all of his protestations about wanting freedom, as suggested by Nin, should probably begin with himself.
Nin that was not a slam at you. I simply meant that before you can shrug off the yoke of oppression you'd damn well better be ready to accept the responsibility of freedom.

Bill said...

Out here, many of the "occupy SF" protesters are getting 11 bucks an hour. That beats McD's. What a country!

Erin O'Brien said...

Sorry, Alph. I did not ask him who pays his bills.

Anonymous said...

@Alph,

I get your point, I think, and am inclined to agree. I suspect there are some snotty nose prepsters out there with their iphones just because they think it's cool and when they get tired they'll fade back into the shadows. But the thing I think gets overlooked because of our partisan politics is AT LEAST THEY"RE DOING SOMETHING. Chit, even in a hotly contested race between Good and Evil like 2008 barely 50% of qualified voters went to the polls. Regardless of ideology I think a democratic country should encourage public demonstrations as a way of engaging the electorate.

RJ

alphadog said...

RJ,
I don't disagree. But ya know, I may be joining those qualified voters who don't bother showing up. Not due to apathy or ambivalence, but because I will no longer flip the lever for someone who does not deserve my support. I'm tired of voting for the guy who's not as bad as the other guy.
Fuck it.
If you're not my idea of a leader and someone I can truly believe in, I'm not wasting my time. We're well on our way down the road to perdition. I'm fairly certain we'll get there regardless which sorry choice offered us is elected.

Bill said...

My suggestion, for the 20 somethings who are protesting but not sure, for what. Join the US military. A level playing field and a great education in how to get a job done.

Anonymous said...

@ RJ-let's keep that talk of 'permits to sleep on the street' talk on the down low...That's likely to wind up in the next Paul Ryan budget proposal as an alternative to Social Security, along with 'lottery numbers for a spot in an emergency room waiting area' as a 'saviour' for Medicaid and 'edible scraps' as a replacement for food stamps...MR

Erin O'Brien said...

I've always said alph: you no votey, you no bellyachey.

Bill said...

If we followed your rule, Erin, we would not have the "occupy" protests. Or, at least, they would be much smaller. I agree with you.

Anonymous said...

Bill, do you really think these people aren't voters, or that they aren't politically active or politically aware?
I really hate to use this word, but that's a really stupid comment...MR

Bill said...

That's alright MR. That word is used a lot here. I think they've done a couple of polls and 1 in 5 of them voted. Voting is different than being "politically active or politically aware". Right?

Erin O'Brien said...

No comment here is stupid. I appreciate every one of them. Let's keep it polite, please, and treat one another with respect.

Go on and swear, opine and rant, but please let's not start with name calling and insults.

Anonymous said...

@ Alphadog-to a certain degree I understand and empathize with the 'a pox on both their houses' sentiment.

But the fact is is that there has been a QUALITATIVE difference in the attitudes towards governance between the two major parties in this country, certainly since the President was elected, and rabidly since the 2010 midterm elections.

I speak of course of the Republican
Party.

Since Election Day 2008, Senator McConnell(R-KY) has repeatedly and proudly stated that his overarching goal in governance is the defeat of the President. Not economic recovery, not recovering from the disastrous foreign policy of the Bush years, and not finding a way to retain the social compact with retirees without gutting their safety net.

Defeating Mr Obama. Job One. Job Only.

The Senate is not a democratic institution. It requires, not due to the Constitution, but because of its own rules, a 60-vote super-majority to move legislation to an up-or-down vote on its merits.
Mr McConnell has taken ruthless advantage of the rules of the Senate to thwart policy initiatives at every turn. Even the most routine, non-controversial measures, such as judicial appointments, are being subjected to the threat of filibuster. Nothing is moving out of the Senate, and Mr McConnell is well satisfied with that turn of events.

The other, and perhaps more crippling development, is the Republican drumbeat against deficits and debt.

There isn't one swinging dick (sorry, women legislators, but to make a point)in the House or the Senate that gave a flying fuck at a rolling donut about debt and deficits between January 20th 2001 and January 20th, 2009-if I recall correctly, it was right after noon when they had their collective epiphany. Former Vice-President Cheney even famously said on the floor of the Senate "Reagan proved that deficits don't matter".

Now, at a time when deficit spending is necessary in the SHORT term, to repair the damage to the economy done to it by the Crash of 2008 and the Great Recession, the Republican Party has done damage to the very process of governing by harping on DEBT-which is a long-term problem, addressable in the long term, and conflating it with DEFICITS, which are a short term evil, necessary to help repair the economy NOW.

There is more that I could add, especially about the damage being done to the political dialogue by the main-stream media with its embrace of the mantra of equivalency between the parties, which is a false equivalency, and demonstrably so, but the grocery shopping and football call.

MR
Go Browns (and Cardinals)(St Louis)
WV: centr-"the centr does not hold"

Anonymous said...

Erin-point taken-
@Bill...please strike the offending word, and substitute the word 'witling'.
MR

Bill said...

I'll go wit ya on that one. Although, I'm right about the majority of the protesters, 4/5ths, not voting.

alphadog said...

Erin, I fully understand your position as I used to subscribe to the same. A while back it dawned on me that, on a national level, we're simply voting for the same shit, different party. I will continue to vote locally as I believe my vote and my voice still has some influence, but nationally, it's merely a token bennie of living in a Democracy (Republic).

And Mike, of course you're talking about the Republican party because it is your wont to do so. I do not say that derisively. We have been programmed since birth to choose sides and I promise you that the ruling class is doing everything it can to keep the citizens at odds with one another so that the more things change, the more they stay the same.

WV: hoedauge.
I think I've been insulted.

Erin O'Brien said...

Hey Bill, got a link on that 4/5 statistic?

Erin O'Brien said...

In the meantime, here's a few statistics from Gallup:

Americans aged 18-29: 30% underemployed.

19% in U.S. struggling to afford food vs. 6% in China

Americans' access to basic needs down in September

Harry Finch said...

Alphadog - Collected this yesterday from G.K. Chesterton, which, I think, goes to your point:

The Party System does not consist, as some suppose, of two parties, but of one. If there were two real parties, there could be no system.

Ms OB - The italics are for you.

Anonymous said...

@ alpha...based upon the case I laid out above, do you still think there would not be a qualitative difference were the Congressional Republicans not conducting themselves as an obstructionist, almost insurrectionist party? And what about what you know of me, based upon your experiences in this space, makes you think I can be programmed?
MR

Anonymous said...

@Harry-
GK Chesterton was writing not from an intimate knowledge of our system, but of a parliamentary system...in the late 19th and early 20th century.

Do you really believe that there would not have been a qualitative difference in our current situation if Al Gore had been elected rather than George Bush selected in 2000?
Militarily? Fiscally? Environmentally?
MR

Anonymous said...

Bill-"I'll go wit ya on that one. Although, I'm right about the majority of the protesters, 4/5ths, not voting."

What polls Bill? You're entitled to your own opinions but not your own facts.

RJ

Harry Finch said...

MR - I know about Chesterton, but thank you for your assumption that I don't.

Perhaps you would like to cite the quote's source.

Chesterton did write about America, but in this case, you are correct; the quote comes from A Short History of England, and he was writing about their parliamentary system.

However, the statement can be applied to the American system, and if you don't agree, you are certainly entitled to your rose-colored glasses.

Do I think things might have been different under Gore? Of course, but it doesn't matter because whatever I believe is sheer speculation.

I'm confident, though, that whomever is in power - and this was Chesterton's point - Money calls the shots. In America, that means corporate interests.

Anonymous said...

Harry-
I knew you know about Chesterton, because, you know, YOU brought him up. What about my comment leads you to believe I assumed you don't know about Chesterton? Can I get you some dip for that chip on your shoulder?

I'm going to revert to my original point, with you and also for Alphadog: The Republican party has been conducting itself in an insurrectionary manner, and is no longer behaving as a loyal opposition but as an enemy of our government itself; they no longer have any appreciable interest in geovernance, but only in recapturing total control of political power.

There is a qualitative difference between the goals and methods of the Democrat party versus the Republican party.

The prostitution of the system is undeniable, but there IS a choice to be made; it is very real, very concrete, and direly pressing. Individuals who throw up their hands in despair, accept the false-equivalence paradigm and give up are wearing aren't even wearing rose-colored glasses. They've been blinded instead by cynicism.

I'll keep my clear-eyed glasses
and continue to seek the best clear chance for my country.
MR

Erin O'Brien said...

Okay MR, I tried to be nice about it, but you leave me no choice.

Quit being a pain in everyone's ass.

--The Management

Anonymous said...

Erin-kindly check e-mail, MR

Bill said...

Erin and RJ: The link for the 4 out of 5 not voting, is actually pretty week. I don't get how they come up with the number but it supports my point of view so I believe it! Damn it! You can see for yourself here

Bill said...

Weak too.

Mrs. C said...

Hey all--Occupy Buffalo was way chill, too. We are an honorable people, by and large.

And for those who think there is no focus to this movement, do a youtube search for "Old Fart Rants" 280 Days--It is raw but articulate and focusing.

Would tghat I could, but I can't: embed a link...! Go watch it; it's delish.

WV: epxvidle: phonetically: epics victual; yes, the Old Fart rant is epically nourishing; GO WATCH IT!

Erin O'Brien said...

Bill, thank you for the link.
While reading it, I aged 15 years, developed gout, arthritis and a loss of hearing. An acute desire to don a worn cardigan and scuffle over to the front door, open it and yell, hey you kids, get off the grass! came over me but I resisted.

I did enjoy this quote:

They are demanding their right to be angry, stomp their feet, hold their breath and generally misbehave publicly when they don’t get what they want in life.

Seemed to me to be a fitting description of our congressional Republicans.

Off to go find Mrs. C's link ...

Erin O'Brien said...

Oh my! Mrs. C's old fart is much more entertaining than Bill's.

I give my hair about 15 years to look like his.

Bill said...

That guy is kind of scary. Take off the hat and put his hair in a pony tail and he looks all of the other angry old hippies around here. Fortunately, as angry as they are, they normally aren't NRA members.

Anonymous said...

Seein' hows I already suffer from gout, arthritis and hearing loss all while wearing cardigan and yelling at the kids I shall pass on Bills link.

However I think I will play on endless link the Ronald Reagan soundbite I heard on the radio this morning in which he said a millionaire using the tax code to avoid paying taxes while a school janitor payed 10% of his income in taxes was, and I quote, "Crazy."
I heard it on NPR this morning. The piece was already in progress when I joined in so I don't know the title but I suspect a slightly ambitious soul could track it down.

RJ

RJ

Harry Finch said...

MR - I heard a professorial tone in your comment that perhaps wasn't there. I apologize for my misinterpretation.

The Money Party has two wings: Republican and Democratic. I prefer the Democratic wing.

Within the Democratic (liberal) wing I see two types: liberals optimistic about the future, and liberals pessimistic about the future. I am one of the pessimists.

Yes, I am cynical. I don't know that I'd go as far as alphadog and say I'm programmed that way; but I would say it does seem to be my nature.

Bill said...

Liberal optimists or liberal pessimists. Half of the coutry is made up of the combination. The liberal use of other peoples money is what they all have in common. That's what makes me worry. I'm not worried about having to pay more taxes, myself. But, the idea that someone, more affluent or successful than me, owes me something is, well, stupid. Did you hear the hatred in the old guys rant? Do you really identify with that? Whatever.

Anonymous said...

"But, the idea that someone, more affluent or successful than me, owes me something is, well, stupid."

Please provide an example of an optimistic or pessimistic Liberal making the claim they are owed something by those more affluent and ergo qualifying for the label "stupid", a label which, when applied to commenters of this here blog has been met with considerable disdain.

RJ

VideoDude said...

If protestors aren't carrying weapons, racists signs and spitting on Congressmen, then The Tepaublicans call them names.

I couldn't find the original Reagan video but here is a splicing of Reagan/Obama:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=cgbJ-Fs1ikA

Bill said...

You have GOT to be kidding! I didn't think I'd hurt any feelings by calling an idea, stupid. For examples of libs being owed something, please watch the President speak and the interviews, with the "occupy" anarchists.

Erin O'Brien said...

Stupid?

I'll give you some stupid. The United States is spending

THREE
HUNDRED
MILLION
DOLLARS
EVERY
DAY

on the war in Afghanistan.

They just cut high school bussing in my community while our soldiers are building schools with my tax dollars in Afghanistan.

If you really want to get smokin' mad, go read the transcript from last night's 60 Minutes interview with Gen. John Allen and you tell me what's stupid.

Bill said...

You won't get an argument from me about that, Erin.

Anonymous said...

Bill
"You have GOT to be kidding! I didn't think I'd hurt any feelings by calling an idea, stupid. For examples of libs being owed something, please watch the President speak and the interviews, with the "occupy" anarchists."

10:56 AM

Hence forth and forever more if I am kidding, particularly when engaging with Bill, I shall say so in my posting.

Now Mr. Bill,

Give me an example where the President (I assume of the US but even if it's of the Rotary Club) and an anarchist or occupier Verbalizes an UNEQUIVOCAL belief that affluent individuals, just by the very fact they possess more stuff, are UNCONDITIONALLY OBLIGATED to give some of their stuff to those with less stuff.

RJ

Bill said...

RJ, If you allow that money is stuff, then we have the President's famous "we have to spread it around" comment and many others. Then we have the "forgive our loans" comments and many others from the "occupy this" group. I didn't feel like googling other examples but, you get the point.

Anonymous said...

Bill,
I am willing to stipulate, for purposes of this conversation, that stuff=money.
Now please explain how statements like "have to spread it around" and "forgive loans" equate to an UNCONDITIONAL OBLIGATION for possessors of more money to give some to possessors of less money.

Feel free to use symbolic language like mathematics.

RJ

Bill said...

RJ, You're the one that put the "unconditional obligation" crap on it. It's something they want! Game. Set. Match.

Anonymous said...

"But, the idea that someone, more affluent or successful than me, owes me something is, well, stupid."

Bill. 10:03 AM

Perhaps I missed the qualifier in this statement. If so I stand corrected. Otherwise, please clarify the idea more affluent owe less affluent money as expressed in the verbalizations of presidents or anarchists or in your recent post "It's what they want."

RJ

Bill said...

We're kind of droning on about this. Speaking of drones; isn't it great that we're the only ones that have them? I'd hate to have to check out what's hovering above everytime I go outside to pick up the paper.

Anonymous said...

Bill.
"We're kind of droning on about this. Speaking of drones; isn't it great that we're the only ones that have them? I'd hate to have to check out what's hovering above everytime I go outside to pick up the paper."

12:13 PM

Unresponsive, IMHO.
Bill, or whoever you are, I and others have tried to engage you in meaningful discourse in the comment section of this here blog but the only thing accomplished is a waste of bandwidth.
I frequent a hair stylist who has a brisk little side business in genital and anal hygiene. I think I will make an appointment to have my anus waxed and bleached. While I've never had the desire to have my salad tossed in this day and time a single guy should probably be prepared. And hence forth and forever more when I have the urge to try to engage with you in this space I'm going to teach myself to default to "Anus" to remind myself that will be more productive than trying to talk to you. I invite other regular and irregular posters at this here blog to prompt me should my behavior modification fail by posting "Anus" under any responses to "Bill."

Thank You very much for your time and attention.

RJ

alphadog said...

Huh. Bet Mom's gonna be mad when she sees this.

Bill said...

LOL! Another angry liberal person. By the way, RJ. TMI.

Erin O'Brien said...

To be honest with you, Alph, I'm sort of tired of playing den mother.

This comment section is open and it's going to stay that way--at least for now. You want a good guideline? If you wouldn't say it across my kitchen table, don't say it here.

Now everybody calm down and go check out the footage in today's post, particularly the unbelievable D-type at the 28 second mark.

alphadog said...

Thank you for the Chesterton reference Harry.
I did not mean to suggest that we are programed to be cynical, I meant that we are programed to choose sides, or teams if you will. Until we transcend that politically, I've no doubt we will continue to slide ever closer to the scenarios portrayed in so many of your writings.

Anonymous said...

Gee, RJ, since "being a pain in everyone's ass" was mentioned above, do they offer novocaine or lidocaine for that treatment?
"Rectum, hell...damn near killed 'im..."
#OCCUPYTHEPARMAMARC'SSTORE

Anonymous said...

@Harry29:45-nbd...MR

Anonymous said...

sorry:@harry, @9:45-no big deal, my friend...MR

Al The Retired Army Guy said...

Damn, look at all those tents. I could make a killing selling "Al TRAG Food" down there.

Al
TRAG

Bill said...

Al, Making a killing selling stuff, is not a popular sentiment at the "occupy everything" events. Although, I know, your comment was not political in nature.

Anonymous said...

@Al...perhaps "killing" in regards to food service is not the best business model
MR

Erin O'Brien said...

What nobody is comfortable with is a movement in which virtually the entire spectrum of middle class and poor Americans is on the same page, railing against incestuous political and financial corruption on Wall Street and in Washington.

--from a must-read column by Matt Taibbi

Anonymous said...

From the comments under Taibbi's piece:

"The upper 1% is perplexed!

They don't know who to bribe, intimidate or smear because there are no leaders!"

The consequence, of course, is that Taibbi and Brietbart blame each other and in turn create content for their respective publications, which is their job.

I hope OWS heeds his warning but also recognizes he is part of the problem.

RJ

Bill said...

Taibbi says this:

"Aside from the appalling fact of these assholes stealing private emails and bragging about it in public, the whole story is completely absurd. None of the people on the list, as far as I know, are actually organizers of OWS -- I know I'm not one, anyway.

In fact, I was surprised by the entire characterization of this list as being some kind of official wing of OWS. I thought it was just a bunch of emails from friends of mine, talking about what advice we would give protesters, if any of them asked, which in my case anyway they definitely did not."

What does that mean? It means the he, a journalist, is trying to help the OWS movement and then report on it. He doesn't do a good job of trying to hide his obvious bias.

Al The Retired Army Guy said...

"Making a killing" is a figure of speech, of course. I could make a bunch of cash down there - I'm surprised Michael Symon isn't down there selling burgers from B Spot. And just what/how are these folks eating, anyway? Donated food? Or are they going into Tower City Center or elsewhere for fast food?

Al
TRAG

Judy said...

Alphadog...haven't read all the comments yet, but needed to respond to Alphadog...vote third party...the best way to tell the parties that we need more variety is to vote third party...

alphadog said...

Actually Judy I do, Libertarian and Independent. Though I would be fibbing if I said I didn't vote for the occasional Republican and yes (gasp) Democrat if I believe them to truly be the best person for the job.
I've long maintained that a viable, vibrant third party is exactly what's needed to kick the status quo off dead center. Unfortunately it's become such a money game that it's near impossible to compete if you don't have one of the two major parties backing you.

Anonymous said...

The Obama administration set a new record for deportations, removing nearly 400,000 undocumented immigrants in the last fiscal year, Immigration and Customs Enforcement announced on Tuesday.-AP

"Give me your tired, your poor, your huddled masses yearning to breathe free." Emma Lazarus

Hebrews 13:2
"Do not neglect to show hospitality to strangers, for thereby some have entertained angels unawares." The Bible-God

RJ

Bill said...

The Verse from Hebrews is an excellent one. The admonition to show hospitality to strangers is directed to each of us as individuals. Each of us has opportunities every day to do what we can. We don't have the right to insist that every other person spend their money on things that we favor. I think you should give money to Doctors without borders. Thanks for your help.

alphadog said...

Doctors Without Borders is a worthy cause. So is this young mans education if anyone feels the urge.
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=126152737490378

BTW, it's critical that occasionally the day ends much better than it started.

Anonymous said...

Give to Medecins Sans Frontieres whenever I can. If I can dust off my very elementary HS French may try to work for them when my youngest gets grown. Wish they wouldn't spend so much on mailouts.

Moving along...I was listening to some old Warren Zevon last night and it hit me. OWS needs music. I suspect there's lots of it being played at those encampments but something that would catch the mood in a rather public way a la Jefferson Airplane, et al.

Peace.

RJ

Erin O'Brien said...

There was a couple of people playing bongos, RJ.

The group in the fourth pic was singing "We shall overcome."

So, um, yeah, OWS's CLE division needs some music.

Bill said...

Actually, what OWS CLE, and others, needs is a message. The emcampments are getting boring and irritating. The recent rape allegation in CLE and the rare but well publicized anti semitic rants and signs, are detracting from whatever points these people are trying to make. They are occupying space but that's about it. Better music won't help.

Erin O'Brien said...

Actually, Bill, what is the message of the tea party? I've heard "taxed enough already," but there haven't been any new federal taxes.

They elected a bunch of people who are passing plenty of anti-abortion laws, but they don't seem to concerned about jobs.

So, really, what's their message?

Bill said...

Erin, Smaller Government, fewer regulations, less spending, follow the Constitution. I know it's over simplified and there is surely some hypocrisy but these people got their message accross, encouraged like minded politicians, got a bunch of them elected by voting for them. Jobs are created by businesses. The left is so jealous of the Tea Party that they wish the occupy movement was like it. It's not. Not even close. I hope Obama keeps up his rhetorical support for this group. But, when they start disbursing or something bad happens, he'll find a way to distance himself, as will the adoring press.

Erin O'Brien said...

Vague arching generalities, Bill, which basically amount to no message.

You want specifics? The 99 percent has specifics.

The heart of the movement has nothing to do with left and right.

Bill said...

Erin, the messaging from the Tea Party worked! Please tell me what the 35 year old woman wants. That's not a message, that's a complaint. My advice to her and her husband: Rent a cheaper, smaller apartment. Get catastrophic health insurance and save $700 per month. Take public transportation. Rebuild your credit over the next several years.
Save a little money out of each paycheck. Don't buy ANYTHING that you don't have cash for. I did these things when I was in my 20's and had 2 children. My wife and I both worked. Different shifts.
I didn't have time to protest.

Anonymous said...

Bill...can you cite just a few examples where the messaging, (so-called)from the Tea party(so-called) worked? Their only message is what they are against, not what they are FOR...and much of what they are against, in the abstract, they are for, in the details...They don't like regulations, but they don't want to give up meat or airline or auto safety inspections; they are against spending, but when they find out what Granny's Scoot-around is gonna cost 'em, Medicare makes loads of sense...they are against tax increases, but when faced with cuts to middle-income benefits programs, they're plenty fine with increasing taxes on the uber-wealthy...
Try and enlighten us on what they are FOR...we already know what they're against...in the abstract...when it doesn't affect THEM...
MR

Anonymous said...

Jonathan Swift - A Modest Proposal
art-bin.com/art/omodest.html

A Modest Proposal


For Preventing The Children of Poor People in Ireland
From Being Aburden to Their Parents or Country, and
For Making Them Beneficial to The Public

By Jonathan Swift (1729)

via RJ

Bill said...

MR, you're missing the point. The message was addressed to the politicians and they elected politicians who agreed with their goals of smaller govt., less spending, etc. They stopped the big spending congress (sort of). Like it or not the Tea Party was/is effective. Let's see which politicians run on the "occupy" agenda.

Anonymous said...

Bill...let me go at this from another angle...so, a cadre of Republican congressmen, mostly freshmen, identifying as Tea Party...has enacted...What?...jobs bills?...immigration reform?...tax reform?...educational reform?...What have they DONE?...we know what they're AGAINST...and you can't govern by being 'against' all the time...MR

Bill said...

MR: They haven't enacted shit. They're a pain in the ass to the other republicans and to the dems. If, and that's a big if, they are able to increase their numbers they might be able to get something done. The next election will be huge. We will see which way the country is going to go. If you have it your way, Obama will win, the dems will gain seats in congress and the country will have GREECED the skids for continuing the slide into mediocrity, or worse.

Anonymous said...

Lemme review: they can't do shit, they're a pain in the ass...so the GOP will now stand for Gulping Our Probiotics?
MR
ps thanks for an especially lucid and pointed answer, my friend...

Bill said...

Now you've got it! No problem.

Anonymous said...

Message:

http://www.rightwingwatch.org/content/tea-party-nation-urges-businesses-stop-hiring-order-hurt-obama

"Tea Party Nation sent to their members today a message from activist Melissa Brookstone urging businesspeople to “not hire a single person” to protest the Obama administration’s supposed “war against business and my country.” Brookstone writes that business owners should stop hiring new employees in order to stand up to “this new dictator,” the “global Progressive socialist movement,” Hollywood, the media and Occupy Wall Street."

via RJ

Bill said...

via, If you own a company and you want to hire someone, you're not going to check with a blogger, left or right wing, before you do it. Businesses aren't hurting Obama. Obama is hurting businesses.

Anonymous said...

Message:

watch?v=G8SoVfTVLrk&feature=related

via RJ

Anonymous said...

^fail.obv

Anonymous said...

Message: Take 2

Erin O'Brien said...

"Obama is hurting businesses."

How, Bill?

Now the question is: are you going to give some vague answer like ... um ... erm ... wait! I know! Healthcare costs! or our you going to give a specific regulation or tax increase?

I doubt you will. Obama's administration hasn't raised taxes. It's gridlock and the right's obstructionist politics that are hurting business. No one knows what's next, what legislation is about to be repealed, what crazy law will be rushed into place.

Business hated the debt ceiling fiasco, which was essentially the tea party with a knife at their throat.

I swear to God, this is all about getting the black guy out of the White House. After all, the only part of that assertion Mitch McConnell left out was "black."

Bill said...

Erin: I cannot prove to you that every business is negatively affected or effected by Obama. I can tell you that there are business friendly states and thoses that are not so business friendly. Obama is not business friendly unless the investors, owners, representatives, donate to his re election fund. Solyndra, for example. Conservative people want the current president out of the white house. Conservative people wanted Clinton out of the white house. Conservative people would have wanted Kerry or Gore out of the white house. It's just too easy to say that conservatives want Obama out because he's half black. You have no proof of that. After all, he was elected. If he is given his walking papers it will be because many of the people who voted for him, won't do it again. And, I hope there are lots of them.

VideoDude said...

Just like the Teapublicans support those that give them money. You know, like Wall Street (Mitt Romney), The Koch brothers (Partners with Iran), and corporations (Like oil companies).

When Tea Baggers where carrying racist signs and spitting on congressmen. What did the Teapublicans in office do? Cheered them on!

Bill said...

VD, I think that $100k reward is still out there for proof of spitting etc. Didn't happen.

VideoDude said...

It took me 30 seconds to find it on YouTube. I guess the racists signs and guns are okay at campaign rallies, right?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bpgh77J7jKk

The White racists commentors sure thought he was spit on. One even called for his death! Just for being black!

Anonymous said...

Erin-to be more accurate, not only has the Obama administration not RAISED taxes, it has passed 18 different tax CUTS...
MR

wv: 'frestful'...slang for 'fucking restful'...ie, 'that rubdown those six japanese girls gave be was frestful as hell, man...'

Bill said...

VD. Yelling with hands cupped around mouth. No spitting. No ethnic slurs. That video has been played a million times. It shows dem congressmen strolling through the unhappy crowd and crowing about the unwanted bill. They could have taken another route if they didn't like the noise and shouting but they wanted that picture to make them look brave and proud. A perfect photo op.


wv: drano.... Perfect

VideoDude said...

Here is a true story about the Teapublican party:

One bright day in the middle of the night,
Two dead buys got up to fight.
Back to back, the faced each other,
Drew their swords and shot each other.
A deaf policeman heard the noise,
Drew his gun and shot the boys.
If you don't believe this lie is true,
ask the blind man or Teapublicans, they saw it, too.

Bill said...

cracking down on OWS

If these board members are paid, you are seeing one of the reasons NY, and other states are in big trouble.

Anonymous said...

zzzzz.......zzz......zzzzzzz....

Bill said...

It is definitely candy ass to post z's anonymously.

Bill said...

The mercenary occupiers. how much do I get to hang out down here?

Bill said...

Haven't heard Howard Stern in a while? OWS spokespeople

Bill said...

No organic chicken for homless OWS class warfare

Anonymous said...

No good lay abouts of Nashville OWS:

“If you don’t hear from me, call the city jail,” 71-year-old Rip Patton told his friends. A veteran of the civil rights struggle, Patton was one of the students who braved arrest and worse to desegregate Nashville’s lunch counters and to bring voting rights to blacks in the Deep South as one of the Freedom Riders.

http://www.tennessean.com/article/20111028/NEWS/310280080/Occupy-Nashville-sparks-memories-Freedom-Riders

RJ

Bill said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Bill said...

Here's RJ's link which is one big stretch!
rediculous comparison

Bill said...

Here's RJ's link in which he tries to compare OWS to the freedom riders. rediculous comparison

Anonymous said...

It's "ridiculous", Bill....
MR

Bill said...

sorry about 2 similar posts. Blogger was holding them for approval and I didn't know it.

Erin O'Brien said...

Comment moderation kids in on any post over two weeks old in order to cut down on spam.

Blogger, however, doesn't feel the need to notify me when comments are in the moderation queue, hence the delay.

Sorry, gents. Do carry on. I'll try to keep up with it.

Bill said...

Thanks MR. You're right. It IS ridiculous and so is my spelling.

Anonymous said...

Sorry I'm late to the dance but it intrigues me that a comment by a participant in both the Freedom Rides/Nashville Lunch Counter Sit-Ins and now Occupy Nashville can be labeled as ridiculous. It's Mr. Patton's comparison, not RJ's. Is the commenter calling Mr. Patton ridiculous or challenging his reality testing?

RJ

Bill said...

'Occupy' Rallies Turn Violent...
Police Tear Gas Oakland Protesters...
Mob Runs Wild in City Streets...
Cops, Protesters Clash in Seattle...
Bloomberg Ready to 'Take Actions'...
Baltimore Cuts Power To Camp...
MN Officials Take Toilets...

Anonymous said...

I swear I almost posted 5,4,3,2,1 til the Occupy Headlines sowed up.


100,000+ Iraq War Civilian Casualties
4,799 Coalition Casualties OEF/OIF

1,704 US Military Casualties in Afghanistan since 2001.
9500 to 29000 Civilian Casualties since 2001.

Cry me a fucking river over OWS.

RJ

Anonymous said...

BTW...
One headline the local right wing schill won't post is that of Tennessee Gov. Bill Haslem(R) getting bitchslapped by the FIRST AMENDMENT OF THE US CONSTITUTION in FEDERAL COURT on Monday 10/31/11 for illegally removing Occupy Nashville protestors from Legislative Plaza in Downtonn Nashville. A small but dedicated group I visited on Sunday, !0/30/11. I chatted with a University Professor of Anhtropology, an Attorney, a Professional Musician, a number of College Students. Hardly the "vermin" that locals called them.
This easily found in "The Tennessean" and the local alternative "Nashville Scene" online. BTW, Johnathon Meador, a reporter for the "Scene" was also arrested even after identifying himself as a member of the media. The states rationale for the arrest and I quote "He smelled of alcohol and was dressed like everyone else." (When last contacted Johnathon was on his way to Cabo to scout out vacation property which he'll purchase with the settlement coming his way.) His arrest was witnessed by an AP reporter and videotaped by bystanders. State EXCUSE is BS!

POVERTY IS THE WORST FORM OF VIOLENCE!

WE ARE MANY!
WE ARE EVERYWHERE!
WE ARE NOT GOING AWAY!

RJ

Bill said...

Sorry, but you don't get a pass on the vermin label just by being a professor, a lawyer, a musician, or a college student. Yeah, I missed that "bitch slap". Have you been reading about the rapes at OWS? Pretty disgusting but unwanted sexual advances down there are OK I guess? I did hear about some consensual sex going on there though. It seems that a broker type, after work, was banging one of the tent residents, and he was actually making trades on his ipad at the same time.

Bill said...

we need more people like this